General Discussion

General DiscussionHow to play CK and Item build / Skill build (questions)

How to play CK and Item build / Skill build (questions) in General Discussion
Niskara

    1. Is he viable mid? (probably not)
    2. Is bottle good?
    3.Would Shadow blade / silver edge be good, I know it would potentially be good vs axe / bb / pa / timber but could you also get it to pickoff or go into a fight with sb and ult?
    4.When do you go midas? Is it good? What skill build is strong?
    5. What skill build?
    6. Is butterfly legit?
    7. What other items are strong?
    8. What's the playstyle of this hero? Fight whenever there's a good opportunity? Or fight with ult and farm when it's not up unless there's a good situation?
    9. I saw Arteezy using phantasm to farm lanes, jungle and splitpush, is that really worth it?
    10. What heroes to pick him against, and what not to pick him against.
    11. How do u go in a fight? Should you hold phantasm until the fight really starts otherwise people just run away, or shaker or someone with huge aoe spells destroys your illusions e.g SK.

    Toto téma bylo upraveno
    November.Rain

      1. Probably more viable than jugger/pl/etc. mid but ofc against ur conventional mid-laners like invo qop etc. he'll need big-time help from a support
      2. Probably
      3. Nah, rod of atos is better for him. Gives him a way to catch ppl and gives stats
      4. You'd go midas if you had a fantastic start ofc. I wouldn't recommend it for mid ck
      5. 1 point in crit, max q and w, ult at lvl 10
      6. Yeah probably. Tho make sure u have his cores first: AC, heart, manta
      7. AC, heart, manta
      8. Imo ck is a fighting and pushing hero. Get armlet and atos, and fight
      9. Theoretically no, there must have been some reason for his doing that, like he was too weak to use his ult to fight, etc.

      evy

        Max reality first
        Ty

        Emiya

          halberd is sick now and it is one of his best items , SnY into manta+helbard seems good , armlet is his most efficient and power-spicky item

          Rocket

            why no echo sabre mentioned?

            Väinämöinen

              echo sabre sucks

              Ofc silver edge is an ok-ish item to get. If you need it for a bristle and no one else can build it, get it. At least it was this way before BB got a bit nerfed.
              Ofc you can try RoA when you have an AM/Timer/Qop in enemy team

              It fulfills the same purpose as the usual items you get after armlet normally, which is providing stats.

              It pops up on the dotabuff guide section regularly.

              If you have an SK/invo etc on the enemy team
              that just kill your illusions you have to wait with using phantasm yes

              you dont need bottle, get stick. you have enough regen from armlet

              midas when you have a really, reall good laning stage. you dont want to delay your hero too much, if you dont abuse his powerspike from minute 10-25 you will fall off hard.

              Heavens Halberd is a very good item to get. For other items just check dotabuff guides.
              I'd say butterfly sucks, you generally want to get strength items.
              You always want to have PT-armlet- stat item (halberd/manta/silver edge)-Heart/AC

              Skill build wisd you want to max choas bolt and reality rift first, with 1 point in the crit for sustain. I sometimes delay phantasm to lvl 11 (not 10, after the talent for extra value) if my lane goes very well.

              Fight when ulti is up whenever you can, take towers and then farm unless you can safely catch out people. I
              always buy smokes ans invade enemy jungle with ulti as soon as i have armlet, because my team wouldnt come if i dont buy a smoke.
              Also you dont really want to be the one to start the teamfight. Its very effective when you can wrap around and come from behind with illusions, if you teams draft allows for that.

              🍩🍪Cookie🍪🍩

                1. Is he viable mid? (probably not) 

                only when you have a wisp, then he's really good, otherwise he's fucking useless mid.

                2. Is bottle good?

                let your wisp get a bottle, you get standard items.

                3.Would Shadow blade / silver edge be good, I know it would potentially be good vs axe / bb / pa / timber but could you also get it to pickoff or go into a fight with sb and ult? 

                please don't, ck isn't a goddamn slark, i thought you're 5k, not 2k. I can see this happening only like 1 in 20 games as a very situational 3rd item for initiations.

                4.When do you go midas? Is it good? What skill build is strong? 

                same as any other carry, when you know you're gonna go lategame regardless of what happens or you completely got shit on in lane.

                alternatively, you can get midas for farm acceleration since the hero has no built in farm mechanism, but make sure that you aren't in a scenario where you have to end the game fast

                5. What skill build? 

                to prevent asking this question for any X hero, just use the guides on dotabuff for that hero: https://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/chaos-knight/guides

                6. Is butterfly legit? 

                only if you lack brain cells, the hero works on str items, it'd be retarded to go for butter over halberd

                7. What other items are strong? 

                to prevent asking this question for any X hero, just use the guides on dotabuff for that hero: https://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/chaos-knight/guides

                8. What's the playstyle of this hero? Fight whenever there's a good opportunity? Or fight with ult and farm when it's not up unless there's a good situation? 

                like any other carry, both. If you are given a free kill, no matter if you have your ult or not you go take it. When you want to go cause the fight, you make sure you have your ult.

                9. I saw Arteezy using phantasm to farm lanes, jungle and splitpush, is that really worth it? 

                That seems retarded, please don't, that shit has 130 seconds cooldown. Unless you're destroying the game and doing it for the shits n gigglez, or somehow there's no way a fight will happen in the next 130 seconds, then it's the stupidest thing I've heard.

                10. What heroes to pick him against, and what not to pick him against. 

                to prevent asking this question for any X hero, just use the matchups on dotabuff for that hero: https://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/chaos-knight/matchups

                as you can obviously see, he's amazing against single target heroes like ursa/huskar/arc

                and terrible against high aoe CC/nukes(sven, sk ,timber), medusa is an exception since she just breaks all your illusions.

                11. How do u go in a fight? Should you hold phantasm until the fight really starts otherwise people just run away, or shaker or someone with huge aoe spells destroys your illusions e.g SK.

                situation dependent, can't answer that.

                Tento komentář byl upraven
                Player 368673122

                  ^ i'd add onto cookies heroes to pick him against with am, personally i'd flag am especially when considering to pick ck as am's scepter have very few skills that interact with it well enough to be able to catch him

                  examples : duel (am has to get linkens instead of scept)
                  tusk snowball (he'll start rolling back at you and can't release it manually giving you time to position where you want him to roll but his teammates can click it to jump in as usual)
                  ck reality rift (works perfectly normal except you'll have the armour debuff instead and random position along line will happen twice)
                  hurricane pike

                  Rocket

                    why does echo sabre suck?

                    evy

                      Replaced by halbert

                      葉富森

                        ck reality rift (works perfectly normal except you'll have the armour debuff instead and random position along line will happen twice)
                        the initial rift will be cancelled so the positioning effect happens once

                        Player 368673122

                          idk test it, but i'm pretty sure it's not cancelled - ie imagine a lion impaling am, it doesn't stun him but it reflects the animation back
                          i imagine it'd be same with chaos bolt, a red spark flies to him then back to you

                          evy

                            Its super easy to play around AM aghanim, and the bigger question is why AM would even get aghanim against CK in the first place

                            evy

                              If AM have agha and illusions around he'll clump at you with the reflected reality rift

                              evy

                                If AM have agha and illusions around he'll clump at you with the reflected reality rift

                                IceCREAM

                                  1.Not really I guess,I mean a lot of mid heroes usually have high mobility.

                                  2.Not really

                                  3.Its not really good,so dont take SB/SE unless you need it as a very situational item to break passives and stuff.

                                  4.I dunno because i never go midas LUL

                                  5.I like to take Chaos Bolt at lvl 1,crit at lvl 2,rift lvl 3,go for ult at lvl 6,and just max stun then rift first.

                                  6.Nope,absolutely atrocious on him.

                                  7.Halberd is insanely good against right click heroes that can clear your illusions fast,like Sven,Tiny,Drow,Sniper,etc.
                                  Assault Cuirass is really good,extra armor and attack speed for your illusions and team.
                                  Echo Saber is pretty good imo,gives him mana regen and slow,also extra damage.
                                  Drums is a pretty good alternative to echo saber,take it when your team is filled with right click heroes.It also provides mana regen so
                                  thats a plus.
                                  SnY is a good replacement for Manta,especially if you run into Earthshaker,I'll still prefer Manta in most cases though.
                                  Skadi might work as your 6th slot item?

                                  8.Play him like you would play any other carry,only join ganks where you'll get a kill,otherwise just farm or push the lane,save ult for
                                  teamfight.

                                  9.Nope,if you want to use illusions to farm or splitpush,might as well get a manta.

                                  10.He's weak to AoE,disables,and basically anything that can take out his illusions quickly.
                                  He literally shreds ANY single target heroes as long as he has ult.

                                  11.Eh it depends,if the enemy have tons of AoE/Disables to fuck you or your illusions up,just hold phantasm until its safe to use it.
                                  But then again if that happens you might not live long enough to use Phantasm so ech.

                                  Take all that I say with a grain of salt cuz im a 2k shitter LUL.

                                  Tento komentář byl upraven
                                  Jacked

                                    im going to avoid answering this 5ks question, and i suggest all normal skill scrubs try resist the urge to share.

                                    i think the most of the question arent very meaningful, except the one on how to use the ULT, and how to fight (what the playstyle of the hero should be) since his ult is actually very CD dependent. it should not be as cuki says, like any carry.

                                    🍩🍪Cookie🍪🍩

                                      not in 3k, but at 5k++ every carry has to be able to teleport and fight/countergank, regardless of their ultimate.

                                      this isn't a hero thing, this is a playstyle of high mmr brackets where you actually have to fight

                                      something that doesn't happen at low brackets as 99% of the fights there are unnecessary and can be avoided.

                                      Tento komentář byl upraven
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