Silver edge, blademail, sheep-stick as extension items all do the trick.
So I tested it in a lobby a bit. Blademail is kinda useless after PA gets Satanic. Silver Edge on it's own is kinda useless as well, since PA will just Manta to avoid Desolate damage and wait the debuff. Hex is super good, 100->0 lvl 25 vs lvl 25 on 5 slot, but it is countered by Linkens, and you probably don't want to go both Abyssal and Hex on Spec for that, or even Aeon Disk and Nullifier is super shit on Spec.
But I assume you’re lobby testing 1v1 6 slotted? Blade mail early-mid works wonders, silver mid-late and sheep late game onwards.
Obviously 1v1 skews this hugely, but aside from that, satanic is a late game item on PA at which point the spec shouldn’t need or rely on blademail and can sell for a different item.
1v1 scenarios are too stupid.
I can 1v2 any 6 slotted heroes as Arc warden as long as I get the jump on them (And I suck at him). Bloodthorn+Nullifier+Scythe+anything
@arin:
Can't TB go jungle since like level 3-4?
no matter how terrible the lane, first wave will be okay since you use meta.
150 secs later you use it again, and after that you can just hit jungle. most high mmr replays I watch they leave the TB to die over and over and still he ends up carrying them.
Yeah, for midgame it's great and with manta Spec just murders PA, but my question was for lategeme, since from what I saw even at the very top level, once PA survives Spec initiation and pops Satanic it's lights out, and not because Spec has blind on Desolate. I tested some options in a lobby rn, and the best seems to be hex+refresher for Spec, that obviously gimps her a bit overall, but extends her initiation a lot. This is countered by Aeon Disk that you have to frame-perfectly Nullify or PA's manta goes off and no Desolate dmg for u. Almost what OSfrog did couple patches ago.
Of course real 1v1 between these two is unlikely, spec will rely on killing the entire enemy team and shouting at her own team to stun that OP piece of shit. Never thought Spectre pickers can have a moral highground in anything.
I can 1v2 any 6 slotted heroes as Arc warden as long as I get the jump on them (And I suck at him). Bloodthorn+Nullifier+Scythe+anything
I do believe Aeon Disk+BKB and/or Manta solves this problem entirely.
no matter how terrible the lane, first wave will be okay since you use meta.
150 secs later you use it again, and after that you can just hit jungle. most high mmr replays I watch they leave the TB to die over and over and still he ends up carrying them.
well yea but then you get flamed by low mmr and they tend to give up and destroy items which is kinda suboptimal
Well, it's not unreasonable to expect ppl to actually itemise specifically against your hero if you are getting out of hand, and of course just judging 1v1 potential is of questionable usefulness. However we are talking 1k here, 1v1s are way more prevalent there and the supposed 3k should definitely take make such considerations instead of going "PA needs to finish the game at 30".
because playing terrorblade with low mmr supports against some bullshit dual lane that takes 0 brain to execute isn't exactly a fun experience
Yeah thats pretty much it tbh. i rly want to play pos 1 in these lobbies as well but the meta means the offlane will just be cancer every game and 1k supports dont understand how to control a lane. Ive been thinking about taking terrorblade mid but idk how that would turn out
At 1.6k bracket I always leave lane early and only come back to depush, or when my roamer/mid is around to get free kill and tower, or when Meta is up and we are crushing it (pfff right).
will apply it to 3k and let you all know in few days
Check out my latest game (4276083506) on this 1.7k account (as TB)
We had a jungler Tidehunter, mid was first time playing invoker ever (He admitted) and obviously fed hard and was level 6 when Sniper was 12, Earthshaker took my lane and used spells to steal last hits and pushed lane hard forcing me to leave lane(and then he proceeded to die in it). Then I tried to retreat into the jungle (which was already shared with Tidehunter), then I noticed every single camp in my jungle is blocked by wards placed by enemy supports (This was really triggering, like wtf this is 1.7k mmr take it easy). Also I had the entire enemy team stalking me and killing me in my jungle over and over.
Don't even get me started on the wards -_- since we had no support players
Im surprised you have the courage to play the safe lane pos 1 in 1.7k. I dont even dare go any lane other than mid out of fear of my midlane failing horribley.
Im surprised you have the courage to play the safe lane pos 1 in 1.7k. I dont even dare go any lane other than mid out of fear of my midlane failing horribley.
It depends on the picks but when the offlane fails it can be pretty much gg. Thats the space creator and the initiator. The carry can always recover if the offlane can put some pressure on the map.
Well I just risked a pos 1 safe lane game and as expected my support decided not to ward after about 10m and my midlane was literally non-existant, but fortunately we still won cause fast push terrorblade and their team were shite anyway
I dont have courage, its just that my mid skills are less than 2k.
my mid does always fail horribly (If he doesn't feed its gg 25 mins https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4277920558 )
At this bracket there is so much space to farm and push, and so much mistake to exploit, one mistake and u get a set of rax with TB.
Honestly I think terrorblade is gonna be my goto now. Just went bot again, they had a storm smurf in the midlane. Invoker feeds the storm to beyond godlike in 14m, storm has an orchid by 12m or something, and I still win the game cause of how gross terrorblade is. Bought an orchid and that storm was dead for the rest of the game.
terroblade is simple, but with the right lockdown the hero can be destroyed (like pudge with troll) if the enemy locks you down, youre gone. thats why i Always prefer tb lastpick
I dont know why you just dont spam your two best heroes cm and potm.....
Neither of them carry hard enough in 1k. CM is an obvious bad choice cause its a pos 5 that sometimes struggles to even secure a safe lane vs a strong offlane duo. Ive played Mirana mid a few times in this bracket and it is decent but situational, and you become increasingly irrelevent as the game progresses.
CM is an obvious bad choice cause its a pos 5 that sometimes struggles to even secure a safe lane vs a strong offlane duo.
Disagree but too long to explain.
About the lane : she has 2 controls (soft & nuke + one stun), helps team globally sustain mana. Can farm jungle when carry can solo and gank, [...]
About the game : Best support farming kit in the game, the 2 controls including one that provides vision over the area, one of the strongest ultimate in the game, a gold talent, perma-frostbite lvl 25, [...]
Don't want to write a novel.
Ive played Mirana mid a few times in this bracket and it is decent but situational, and you become increasingly irrelevent as the game progresses
Mirana is versatile (nuke, escape, gank, steroid, global utility) which is the opposite of situational. And disagree again, she can destroy some carries with her steroid leap.
PS: yes my winrate is shit on CM because I used to play her jungle long time ago.
Im surprised you have the courage to play the safe lane pos 1 in 1.7k. I dont even dare go any lane other than mid out of fear of my midlane failing horribley
That might be because Vandal here is a bit of a higher caliber player than yourself, so he is actually capable of solo carrying 1.7k games. Unlike yourself. Which is weird, since you are a brain of a 3k player mistakingly locked in a 1k trashbag limp-limbed body. One would assume you were capable of making right decisions from time to time. But no,
Ive played Mirana mid a few times in this bracket and it is decent but situational, and you become increasingly irrelevent as the game progresses.
you can't carry games with Mirana, a hero with 3.2 fucking Agi growth and a 5 second stun, coz she's useless lategame. Unless you consider aforementioned stats and actually farm some after the laning phase that is.
She has the stats and skills^^ for it though. So the correct way to address it would be that you are too bad to carry games with Mirana. After having a 100 games on the hero. But sure, keep seeng a smurf in every enemy that does comparatively well, that sure gonna elevate your gameplay to a new level. Oh, my bad, not your gameplay, your flameplay.
Used to think like OP until I saw a potm DESTROYING a 5-6 slotted void 1 month ago comitting 2 leaps buff after a successful arrow (1leap was used to get closer) => +1.
The thing is POTM is situational. I know the hero has the potential to solo carry because I have done it myself with the hero but the problem is its not a super hard carry. You are dependent on your unreliable stun and the enemy team not buying detection, and contrary to popular belief, people in 1.7k actually do ward quite a lot when you have invis. If you land arrows then yeah fine a 6 slotted Mirana beats basically all of the hero pool but the thing is you cant 1v9 as a Mirana. Despite having starstorm she is largely a single target hero and she is too fragile to take on more than a couple heros in a team fight. Its a solid situational pick and is one of my fave heros to play when I had decent teammates but its a difficult hero to snowball and 1v9 with.
No i dont want to race u cause
A) its not a competition
B) im not super active in dota atm i dont have time
Not being capable is definitely not a reason. You must be one of those 3k players who rush naked no boots Radiance and pick pure junglers into push lineups.
Not being capable is definitely not a reason. You must be one of those 3k players who rush naked no boots Radiance and pick pure junglers into push lineups.
Feel free to find a game where I rushed no boots radiance and picked a pure jungler into a push lineup
This was a jungle into push lineup example, you def gotta start learning to read. Or learning doing anything for that matter. Outside of jungling for naked Radiance that is, I think even you aren't dumb enough to do both of the most gamelosing techniques at once.
How is that "not answering to trolls" thing of yours going btw? I sense the same willpower and persistence as in everything else you fail to do.
I need to learn how to read? Didnt I just say I picked that mid and was forced into a jungle? Yet you are still toxic enough to take that as me outright picking a jungler from the start of the game instead of paying attention to what I actually said
because playing terrorblade with low mmr supports against some bullshit dual lane that takes 0 brain to execute isn't exactly a fun experience
But I assume you’re lobby testing 1v1 6 slotted? Blade mail early-mid works wonders, silver mid-late and sheep late game onwards.
Obviously 1v1 skews this hugely, but aside from that, satanic is a late game item on PA at which point the spec shouldn’t need or rely on blademail and can sell for a different item.
1v1 scenarios are too stupid.
I can 1v2 any 6 slotted heroes as Arc warden as long as I get the jump on them (And I suck at him). Bloodthorn+Nullifier+Scythe+anything
@arin:
Can't TB go jungle since like level 3-4?
no matter how terrible the lane, first wave will be okay since you use meta.
150 secs later you use it again, and after that you can just hit jungle. most high mmr replays I watch they leave the TB to die over and over and still he ends up carrying them.
Of course real 1v1 between these two is unlikely, spec will rely on killing the entire enemy team and shouting at her own team to stun that OP piece of shit. Never thought Spectre pickers can have a moral highground in anything.
I do believe Aeon Disk+BKB and/or Manta solves this problem entirely.well yea but then you get flamed by low mmr and they tend to give up and destroy items which is kinda suboptimal
@SayingPleaseHelps
You're only saying those items because I told you what I would get.
And this is another reason why 1v1 scenarios are stupid
Well, it's not unreasonable to expect ppl to actually itemise specifically against your hero if you are getting out of hand, and of course just judging 1v1 potential is of questionable usefulness. However we are talking 1k here, 1v1s are way more prevalent there and the supposed 3k should definitely take make such considerations instead of going "PA needs to finish the game at 30".
Yeah thats pretty much it tbh. i rly want to play pos 1 in these lobbies as well but the meta means the offlane will just be cancer every game and 1k supports dont understand how to control a lane. Ive been thinking about taking terrorblade mid but idk how that would turn out
At 1.6k bracket I always leave lane early and only come back to depush, or when my roamer/mid is around to get free kill and tower, or when Meta is up and we are crushing it (pfff right).
will apply it to 3k and let you all know in few days
boys if u want to watch how to win dota, watch the replay for this game 4267609976
look at what i type in all chat and how it plays at BEFORE the game starts :)
Too bad FB went on a support, but the fake Tiny Airlines move is quite great, I must admit. Not NTH Roshan bait level but kinda close.
No, not quite NTH level but this was a random solo queue so to organise the boys to actually commit to that was quite impressive.
That was actually impressive as hell
Immortal level plays
@ eXceL
Congrats on getting a badge that actually matters!
i still aint convinced you belong outside of the 1kmmr bracket
@SayingPleaseHelps
Ty, it was all in that tiny airlines move
Check out my latest game (4276083506) on this 1.7k account (as TB)
We had a jungler Tidehunter, mid was first time playing invoker ever (He admitted) and obviously fed hard and was level 6 when Sniper was 12, Earthshaker took my lane and used spells to steal last hits and pushed lane hard forcing me to leave lane(and then he proceeded to die in it). Then I tried to retreat into the jungle (which was already shared with Tidehunter), then I noticed every single camp in my jungle is blocked by wards placed by enemy supports (This was really triggering, like wtf this is 1.7k mmr take it easy). Also I had the entire enemy team stalking me and killing me in my jungle over and over.
Don't even get me started on the wards -_- since we had no support players
I still won that game
That's how bad this bracket is xd
1.7k players don't go for this strat. They are too greedy.
they probably noticed im a smurf after seeing my profile (watch the replay you'll see)
Im surprised you have the courage to play the safe lane pos 1 in 1.7k. I dont even dare go any lane other than mid out of fear of my midlane failing horribley.
It depends on the picks but when the offlane fails it can be pretty much gg. Thats the space creator and the initiator. The carry can always recover if the offlane can put some pressure on the map.
Well I just risked a pos 1 safe lane game and as expected my support decided not to ward after about 10m and my midlane was literally non-existant, but fortunately we still won cause fast push terrorblade and their team were shite anyway
I dont have courage, its just that my mid skills are less than 2k.
my mid does always fail horribly (If he doesn't feed its gg 25 mins https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4277920558 )
At this bracket there is so much space to farm and push, and so much mistake to exploit, one mistake and u get a set of rax with TB.
Honestly I think terrorblade is gonna be my goto now. Just went bot again, they had a storm smurf in the midlane. Invoker feeds the storm to beyond godlike in 14m, storm has an orchid by 12m or something, and I still win the game cause of how gross terrorblade is. Bought an orchid and that storm was dead for the rest of the game.
terroblade is simple, but with the right lockdown the hero can be destroyed (like pudge with troll) if the enemy locks you down, youre gone. thats why i Always prefer tb lastpick
I dont know why you just dont spam your two best heroes cm and potm.....
Girl doto player and cm/potm name a more iconic trio.
^ed edd n eddy
kotl is the best
vote kotl
no seriousy if we can have kotl as our president, noone shall pass the guardian medal.
Disagree but too long to explain.
About the lane : she has 2 controls (soft & nuke + one stun), helps team globally sustain mana. Can farm jungle when carry can solo and gank, [...]
About the game : Best support farming kit in the game, the 2 controls including one that provides vision over the area, one of the strongest ultimate in the game, a gold talent, perma-frostbite lvl 25, [...]
Don't want to write a novel.
Mirana is versatile (nuke, escape, gank, steroid, global utility) which is the opposite of situational. And disagree again, she can destroy some carries with her steroid leap.
PS: yes my winrate is shit on CM because I used to play her jungle long time ago.
@ OP
That might be because Vandal here is a bit of a higher caliber player than yourself, so he is actually capable of solo carrying 1.7k games. Unlike yourself. Which is weird, since you are a brain of a 3k player mistakingly locked in a 1k trashbag limp-limbed body. One would assume you were capable of making right decisions from time to time. But no,
you can't carry games with Mirana, a hero with 3.2 fucking Agi growth and a 5 second stun, coz she's useless lategame. Unless you consider aforementioned stats and actually farm some after the laning phase that is.Nevermind this was originally a reply to the retard above me but I remember saying I wasnt gonna reply to trolls now
Mirana doesnt solo carry late games by the way.
Used to think like OP until I saw a potm DESTROYING a 5-6 slotted void 1 month ago comitting 2 leaps buff after a successful arrow (1leap was used to get closer) => +1.
The thing is POTM is situational. I know the hero has the potential to solo carry because I have done it myself with the hero but the problem is its not a super hard carry. You are dependent on your unreliable stun and the enemy team not buying detection, and contrary to popular belief, people in 1.7k actually do ward quite a lot when you have invis. If you land arrows then yeah fine a 6 slotted Mirana beats basically all of the hero pool but the thing is you cant 1v9 as a Mirana. Despite having starstorm she is largely a single target hero and she is too fragile to take on more than a couple heros in a team fight. Its a solid situational pick and is one of my fave heros to play when I had decent teammates but its a difficult hero to snowball and 1v9 with.
I was very short with free time nowdays, but I'll have upcomin weekend free and I'll try to get to 2k.
My current MMR is like 1.5k here.
Parma, do you want to race to 2k mmr?
No i dont want to race u cause
A) its not a competition
B) im not super active in dota atm i dont have time
@OP
Not being capable is definitely not a reason. You must be one of those 3k players who rush naked no boots Radiance and pick pure junglers into push lineups.
Well I tried.
git gud
It literally takes 10 seconds https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4235789261 Alchemist jungle into Pugna/Lesh/Axe.
Except I picked a mid alchemist and got outdrafed by a last pick mid monkey king so I maximised my farm by going jungle instead.
Oh and look I didnt even rush a radiance
zzzzzz
This was a jungle into push lineup example, you def gotta start learning to read. Or learning doing anything for that matter. Outside of jungling for naked Radiance that is, I think even you aren't dumb enough to do both of the most gamelosing techniques at once.
How is that "not answering to trolls" thing of yours going btw? I sense the same willpower and persistence as in everything else you fail to do.
I need to learn how to read? Didnt I just say I picked that mid and was forced into a jungle? Yet you are still toxic enough to take that as me outright picking a jungler from the start of the game instead of paying attention to what I actually said
omg, will this thread ever end?
I doubt it