General Discussion

General DiscussionClimbing herald to archon = regret

Climbing herald to archon = regret in General Discussion
Shanks

    i tried hard to rank up from herald to archon but archon are full of shits. I play only support and play best as i can, but every game there's always a high iq coach wannabe, dictating what to do which results in tilting the other team members.

    Most of cores are "playing coach" they blame and dictate teammates as if they are better player, instead of focusing on winning.

    how to deal with this? aside from mute

    Ad.Goku™(tv/adgoku24)

      Just ignore them and play your game. There's literally nothing else you can do that will be productive. You either continue to play seriously with a handicap and have a small chance at winning, or abandon the chance of winning and spend the rest of the game trying to tilt them.
      Below 3k, as long as you have at least 1 core that's decent, you have a fair chance at winning the game if you play around them.

      Jiggalo

        Sooooo... I "think" I might be one of these "coach wannabe's" that you are referring to.

        So the first question that I have is... is ANYONE on the team attempting to communicate and coordinate plays?

        For example. "Hey guys, there's a power spike window on our team right now, let's smoke up as five and roam through enemy jungle" or "Hey guys, we really need to secure the next roshan, can we group up now and take over that area of the map?".

        Because if you are complaining about this type of communication then YOU are the problem. In low skill games, communication in the average pub game is complete garbage, so I frequently find myself forced into the role of "team playmaker/communicator". My attitude being that, dota 2 is a game in which communication is absolutely ESSENTIAL and if noone else is going to do it I guess I have to.

        Now there is another "level" of communication that is not strictly necessary, but that nonetheless can help me win games... and this is the old: "hey mate, maybe don't roam through the enemy jungle by yourself right now... All enemy are missing and you've fed like that 3 times already this game."

        Sure TECHNICALLY I am being bossy and telling you what to do... but maybe you just need someone with superior map awareness to warn you from time to time, and maybe you should set your pride and ego aside for this one time and take some advice.

        THEN there is the final level of "bossy teammate" which is mostly counter-productive and mostly comes from anger (and unsurprisingly) only seems to come out during a losing game.
        For example: "Dude, WTF ARE YOU DOING? WE ARE FOUR OF US TRYING TO PUSH HIGH GROUND AND YOU ARE JUNGLING... FUCKING NOOB!"

        So, to sum up, if you are only complaining about the final level of bossy teammate then I am on your side and I recommend just muting those types. If however you are complaining because someone is pointing out a repeated mistake or simply trying to coordinate a team of non-communicators then I'd say maybe team games simply aren't for you and you should try starcraft 2.

        Ad.Goku™(tv/adgoku24)

          ^The problem with that is you are a 2k player, playing with fellow 2k players.
          "If I'm bad then everyone is equally bad"
          which results in
          "Why the fuck is this dog trying to teach me how to play"

          Further adding to "why ppl hate coach wannabe"
          The reason why ppl hate coach wannabe's is that they don't coach, they try to enforce their thoughts.
          "WHY ARE YOU MAKING THIS"
          "WHY DON'T YOU STICK WITH ME"
          "WE ARE LOSING CAUSE YOU DON'T DO THIS"
          All of the above and much more, while they are playing equally bad.

          You see, making communication is not the problem, it's how you communicate.
          "Yo, I'm super strong right now, let's stick and fuck em up" - will have a high chance of working than "Listen to me, come with me and play"
          "hey, I feel xxxx item will be good for us" instead of "Make xxxx item"

          Also, stop trying to sound like a smartass using big words like "power spike", "group up", "window", blah blah. That makes you sound obnoxious to random ppl.
          Try to use words that sound like a spartan commander trying to hype his army and I bet my left nut ppl will march to their deaths with you.

          Lastly, the best you can do is make suggestions in as convincing way as possible, beyond that you can do nothing. You cannot control your teammates.

          Jiggalo

            The pure irony of Ad.Goku lecturing me on how to not lecture people... xDDDD

            You're literally the least self-aware person on these forums mate. I've seen LOADS of toxic posts by you shit-talking and flaming other people on these forums over the last 3 years or so. Now you wanna come here and talk like YOU of all people have a right to lecture others on correct language usage!?

            Pffft go f--k yourself.

            If you had bothered to rub your 2 brain cells together before you fired off a response, you'd see that the main examples I outlined in my answer to the original post USE basically the same tone of language that you yourself have used as an example of "ok communication".

            And as for you trying to tell me not to use "power spike" and other commonly used dota terms... this just shows me what a judgemental clown you truly are.

            Ad.Goku™(tv/adgoku24)

              I didn't contradict you, that's just your self esteem triggering you.
              I literally even mentioned [Further adding to "why ppl hate coach wannabe"] to make it clear.

              And what you showed is a classic example why low mmr dogs can't handle communication.
              You literally went all offensive over literally nothing that was directed to you, in addition, all I said was just emphasize your point to add a bit more clarity.

              This is freaking hilarious. Low mmr dogs helping me prove my points time and time again will never get old.

              -XoD^

                Honestly, the answer depends on what your goals are from dota.
                If your goal is to improve and continue climbing over time, the best way imo, is to just mute all 4 teammates at the start of the game after hero picks are done.

                Focus on your own decision making and gameplay, and use external tools (guides, content, coaching, analysing own and high mmr replays) to improve over time.
                Below 6k, there is no communication needed that cant be expressed through pings.

                It wont stop your teammates from being tilted, but remember for each deluded 2k coach on your team, there is one on your enemy team too who is tilting the crap out of them. 3 tilted teammates vs 4 tilted opponents is a pretty good trade imo.

                Trying to change their behavior or delusions mid-game is pointless, as you can see from Crystal meth's ramblings on how his coaching is essential to winning and his success, despite him having a 44% winrate in archon ranked.

                Oct

                  I think good communication can actually really help your team, especially mentally. I think just having a positive outlook on the game impacts team moral (and therefore performance) immensely. That being said negative communication (telling people what to do, flaming, etc) has the exact opposite effect, so you have to be very careful with your words.

                  As a pure 5 player for the past few years, I attribute a lot of my current success to just good communication, being friendly with your team and throwing out suggestions for plays. I think my mechanical skill is fairly poor, and the only reason I am where I am is due to the ability to maintain good team cohesion through communication.

                  My outlook on communication in dota may be biased though, as I have never played ranked below legend, and didn't communicate when I first started playing.

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